This episode follows on from last week’s episode where we unravel the WallStreetBets/GameStop saga.
Today, we discuss what net worth consists of and whether simply injecting certain countries and populations is the solution to solving the world’s fundamental problems.
Key discussion points in this episode:
- Is wealth bad?
- Are Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos too wealthy?
- Why do rich people get so much hate?
- Trying to comprehend their net worth?
- Are they sitting on $180+ billion of cash?
- What is meant by ‘net worth’?
- Are Musk and Bezos doing good for humanity and the planet?
- Should billionaires sell all their assets to solve world poverty?
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What is Getting It?: In a Nutshell
A conversation where we explore topics both familiar and unfamiliar to us to find out what makes them interesting, so that we can expand our horizons and further our understanding of the world and people around us.
From science to lifestyle design, languages to religion, plus everything in between – anything can be interesting if exposed to you through the right lens. We hope to spark your curiosity through open-minded and thoughtful discussion, as well as a healthy dose of overthinking.
Subaan is a 4th year medical student, motion designer, and an avid rabbit hole explorer. He has keen interests in lifestyle design, technology, investing, and metabolic health. Follow him on Instagram and Twitter.
Dan is a 5th year medical student, pianist, and random fact connoisseur. He spends most of his time learning about languages, playing sports, music, and geopolitics. Follow him on Instagram and Twitter.
Daniel Redfearn 0:01
Hello, and welcome to getting it to conversation
Subaan Qasim 0:03
where we try to understand life just that little bit more.
Daniel Redfearn 0:07
My name is Dan. And my name is Subaan. We’re both medical students based in London.
Subaan Qasim 0:12
And this episode follows on from where we left last week’s episode. Today we discuss whether Elon Musk Jeff Bezos and other billionaires have too much both and whether they should sell all their assets to solve world problems, like pod poverty more directly.
Daniel Redfearn 0:26
Okay, so that makes me think of a couple of questions I’ve got for you. Surrounding sort of, okay, using Jeff Bezos as an example. So we’re saying that he’s a good CEO, like a good leader in terms of the way he’s grown Amazon, right. But a lot of people would also argue that he puts that above the treatment of his employees, which can matter to in a way, I mean, this isn’t a topic I know much about, and you may not have an answer for that. But I was just curious to know your thoughts on that.
Subaan Qasim 0:56
Yeah, I’ve heard about this. And I mean, I can’t really say too much one, I’ve never really worked at Amazon or done anything about that. So you applied for a job as a prime delivery driver, you know, so maybe you’ll be able to get some insight onto that. To get those dividends. Yeah. Yeah, in terms of how he treats his workers, I don’t know if that’s talking about, like, the way he like the kind of culture he enforces. So that affects workers lowered down like seeing factories, or if that’s referring to workers, like employees that work with him directly, like, you know, the higher the higher ups, basically, within the management of the company. So I don’t know which one is talking about.
Daniel Redfearn 1:31
I think it’s
about the people who work in the warehouses and stuff.
Subaan Qasim 1:35
Oh, right. Okay.
Daniel Redfearn 1:37
And it kind of, sorry to interrupt, but they’re kind of, I think, plays into a wider image of Jeff Bezos. Again, just stuff I’ve seen on Twitter and through the internet, which is kind of that he. He’s very, very wealthy, obviously, the richest world’s second richest man in the world at the moment.
Subaan Qasim 1:57
And now I think he’s back first, again, is he okay, it’s basically going back and forth all the time, because it’s all based on Tesla stock price. So it goes up and down with that.
Daniel Redfearn 2:05
Yeah. All right. Okay. So with this dip, he’s going to talk. So he, yeah, there’s this sort of image of him being like, a wealth hoarder as well, you know, like, he has so much money, why does he not give more money away, he could really solve some major issues in the world. And I think it’s very fair to ask that question. You know, like, um, why is he not mobilizing more of that money, putting it to good causes? I can see why that question would be asked, and I often think about that myself, like, how much money would he be able to liquidate or set aside without it being detrimental to Amazon, for example, and, you know, able to make a really big difference in the world? Why does that not happen more? So it’s a two pronged question, one, the treatment of the employees? And secondly, why does Jeff Bezos not give more of his money away?
Subaan Qasim 2:54
Okay, so, yeah, with regard to treatment of workers, like I said, I can’t really comment on it, because I haven’t even looked into it or researched into it too much. But I guess I probably will do a lot more research into it now, just to see what it’s actually like, or at least get some insights into it. I’m not trying to justify that the amount of money he has, because he’s so successful when he’s grown a company and had impact on the world in certain ways, that it justifies him being able to treat workers badly. Never Is that acceptable. But yeah, I don’t know if it is true, how well substantiated the claims are or, and if they are, you know, well substantiated, and it is true. Well, you know, my, my point I’m trying to make about money isn’t related to Jeff Bezos, specifically, it’s more about just wealth in general. So how I can’t really comment on his character, because I just haven’t, you know, listened to enough of him and how he works and stuff, but in terms of his intentions, and notions, in terms of actually why he created the company and how he, you know, pan the company and stuff. I know, he had pretty solid, he had pretty simple goals initially. And he just had extremely, extremely good foresight in terms of being able to predict things and was a good leader in that sense. But whether that came at the cost of him treating his workers badly, just by overworking them or stressing them out or being really harsh, and, you know, I can’t comment on that, but if it is true, I don’t really vibe with that. And yeah, okay, so then going on to the second part of the question, which was, well, he was, let’s just say around 185 billion, or whatever. I think his net worth was. Well, I know, it’s around 186 or something.
Daniel Redfearn 4:31
Along those lines. Yeah.
Subaan Qasim 4:31
So 180 6 billion. So huge amount, like you can’t even comprehend how how much that is, I guess, to kind of put the scale of a million to a billion, or Yeah, I think how long is a million seconds? A million seconds is like one week. He
Daniel Redfearn 4:47
so yeah, just over a week, nearly two weeks.
Subaan Qasim 4:50
Okay. Yeah. So we’re million seconds is two weeks. Do you know how long a billion seconds is? I think 37 years.
Daniel Redfearn 4:58
Yes. If you just give me one second. Yep, so I’ve consulted the the internet. Yes, the internet. And yeah, so it’s about 32 years
Subaan Qasim 5:08
32 or 37
Daniel Redfearn 5:09
Incredible perspective, though that’s, that’s the best one for me for visualization of wealth 11. You know, because we can check out a million, we can check out a billion in our head, and just think that’s a huge amount of money. He this person has 50 million, this person has 50 50 billion, but a million being 11 days, a billion being over 30 years. They’re incompatible. So Jeff Bezos has 180 billion as his net worth. Yeah. But what does that mean his net worth?
Subaan Qasim 5:35
Ah, good question. Just to help that quantity into scale. Again, I saw a tick tock when this whole kind of just phasers kancil culture was coming around. It was a tick tock of like, these people only had like grains of rice, like if one grain of rice is this much, and then he was like, this is like 1 million. This is like 10 million, this is 1 billion. And this is 186 billion. It’s a huge pile of rice compared to everything else. I’ll try and find that Tiktok in the link in the show notes, because I that’s another that’s more visual way to kind of understand the scale. But your question about what his net worth. So Jeff Bezos, and like Elon Musk, and you know, all these high net worth individuals having hundreds of billions as their net worth, they don’t have this sitting in their bank account, they don’t just have access to this cash. quite an interesting point is that, you know, Musk doesn’t have any salary from Tesla, he, he gets paid in stock options into Tesla. And so that’s why his net worth is rising with Tesla. But he doesn’t actually have any cash in his account. He actually I think he pays his for his daily expenses, like his normal living expenses with loans, because he can, he’s leveraged to be able to take out like huge loans because of his net worth. And that’s the thing that net worth, the good thing with these people having so much net worth is the amount of leverage that they have that I’ll get into that later. But what this basically means is all of his assets, so that means stuff like his house, I guess in the UK, most people’s net worth is in the house if they own a house. So house savings, cash in your bank account and stuff, but also investments, so it investments into anything, whether it be in bonds, whether it be in stocks, and shares. So you can’t just trade the share for like, I can’t buy a pizza with one, like naught point naught, three shares of Tesla or something, it just doesn’t work like that. You’d have to sell out here. So or Jeff Bezos would have to sell out of his stake in Amazon. I think he owns around 11% of Amazon is his total ownership, which is still the largest position. I think it’s 11%. I can’t remember. So he’d have to sell out of that, to actually have that cash in his hand. Obviously, not all of it. All of his 186 billion net worth is as a result of Amazon stock. Obviously, a lot of it is but he also has other investments he isn’t he also invested invests his cash in other companies most likely, I don’t know what they are. If he does have any. He, he almost certainly has some holdings. So he’s probably in treasuries, bonds, and probably other things like gold, like other assets. And he has another common like Blue Origin. space. Yeah, that’s his space company. Why is it with billionaires making space companies in a mosque? Jeff Bezos? Neela? Yeah, let’s mess around in space. I guess they can, like weird flex, but okay. But um, yeah, so he doesn’t have access to this cash. So I guess that kind of, well, okay. So he could have access to that cash. So when you see you’re trading to onto a robin hood, Robin Hood account, you see that green, you’re like, Yo, man, I’m in the green, I’ve got these profits, you don’t have those profits, those unrealized gains, when you click sell, now that cash is in your account, now you have those profits. So these are unrealized gains. And his net worth is and your net worth is tied to all the assets that you own stocks being one of them. And for the CEOs of these big companies, they tend to at least have that the founders, they tend to have the majority, or like a large amount of holding in these companies, to the point where they are the largest shareholder in a particular company. And the reason they want to keep that is so that they can have they can maintain ownership of the company in terms of being able to make decisions. Yeah, because when it comes to shareholders and shareholder votes and stuff, they have the biggest influence because they own most like the largest portion of the company.
Daniel Redfearn 9:24
So when you’re the primary shareholder, obviously, that gives you a lot of power. Exactly. If you liquidate or if you sell those shares, then you lost your influence in the company.
Subaan Qasim 9:33
Yeah. So if Jeff Bezos then sells out of his, say even half of it, then I don’t think he’ll be the largest shareholder in Amazon. And now his power and influence in terms of being able to make decisions goes down dramatically. And this is a major point because it’s because of his decision making and his aggressiveness and being ambitious and like all these embedded endeavors, say with like AWS People are like, what the hell, AWS. And then, yeah, people just like what you’re doing. And I was like, if you’re a new startup company, and you don’t host your stuff on AWS, you’re like laughter. So that’s like Amazon Web Services, if you don’t know them, people don’t love, like general consumers of Amazon and stuff don’t really know that side of, and that generates a lot of revenue for them. So it’s almost like a no other company. And companies like you up, you know, most companies that you know, most, I mean, I would invest in companies like Amazon and Tesla basically, like, hundreds, if not 1000 startups in a single company, because they are innovating to a different level. So much, and this requires a lot of capital to be able to just burn. And it requires really aggressive decision making and forethought. And like foresight, like just being able to be like, Nah, man, the market is gonna move in this way, or, you know, the internet is gonna scale up like this. And you almost took advantage of that. And, you know, Musk, and Jeff Bezos seeing, like, how he could scale out Amazon, he had this whole thing of prime and everything and just doing one day delivery, he had this from the get go in his head, basically, not many people have that. And now if he loses his majority ownership in all like his the largest stake in Amazon, then he loses a lot of that power and being able to make this kind of decision, even if you are still the CEO. I mean, he’s not the CEO anymore, actually, since he resigned. So that was pretty interesting. But he’s still on the main, like, you know, managing, like Board of Directors, basically. I can’t remember what he stepped down to.
Daniel Redfearn 11:36
But he could, could he not be doing more still to? Because I mean, he still has, I’m sure he has a lot of funds available still compared to the normal person? Could he still not be doing more? You know, I think that’s the point that a lot of people make. It’s not that he has? Well, first of all, I think it’s clear that, you know, it’s not just that he has $150 billion. For example, if if he if he spent 150 billion on tackling world hunger and eradicating a few diseases with vaccination programs, he’d still have 30 or 40 billion left, which is enough for so many lifetimes. But even Aside from that, with the money that so it’s clear that that’s not you’ve already explained why that that’s not possible. But basically, this what I’m saying, Yeah,
Subaan Qasim 12:22
so say, if he did sell, why doesn’t he just sell it and solve all of these problems in the world?
Daniel Redfearn 12:26
He could either do that, or could he not also just make $1 billion available and do a lot with $1 billion? It’s that kind of money. Yeah,
Subaan Qasim 12:36
yeah. Okay. Um, yeah, this is always a hard one to argue. But I guess you have to see, like, almost, you almost have to see the other side of it. That sounds so bad. I probably shouldn’t phrase it like that. And I don’t mean it like that. But these people like so we’re always going back to the two richest people Bezos and musk. The companies that they’re involved in, and which has these companies which have skyrocketed, their net worth, these companies are making massive change to the world. The way we live is different, like, a couple episodes, or a few episodes ago, we were mentioning like with a, what’s it called the Black Friday sales and stuff. There was a delay in delivery times. And I At first I was shocked. I was like, why is it gonna be longer than one day delivery? And then I kind of recollected my thoughts and I was like, why am I irritated that it’s not going to be one day delivery? I shouldn’t be irritated. Really. Like that’s such a kind of capitalist mindset, like, Oh, I want it now instant gratification, I wouldn’t know. But instant kind of stuff. There’s no patience in anything like it used to be, which is probably a more normal way of living. He influenced the world with this kind of thing, or at least the Western world. I guess they’re kind of expanding in other you know, say developing countries and stuff in other parts of the world but seeing the UK and and the US. I one day delivery. I think the US has a two day delivery guarantee or something UK is one day I guess just because it’s smaller, it’s a lot easier, does change the way we buy things. And obviously in a situation like the coronavirus pandemic that we’re in being able to just buy things online if there wasn’t a such a big company and infrastructure like Amazon, I think we would be struggling just as an entire population a lot more in terms of being able to get certain goods or certain deliveries, right. So in deliveries you can’t like buy on Tesco delivery or something and even the Tesco delivery service is slower and less efficient. This is different. I need something I can just get it my brother actually bought as my sister’s birthday recently. My brother bought a present for her on Amazon so he just bought on Amazon delivered it to her address as a gift. He so he ordered it the day before to arrive the next day with one day delivery. He ordered it like 11am arrived at her house on the same day at like 8pm it’s almost too quick The surprise of the birthday present. But this is the impact he’s made in that kind of sense. Like, you’re using Amazon Prime a lot of apps, I’ve said this before. So I use notion if I was to boycott Amazon or something, I would have to stop using notion because they host their entire thing, or at least a good decent amount of on AWS loads of companies, hosted all the web services and stuff that needs to be hosted somewhere on the internet, on Amazon servers. What do we do then? Do we just stop using everything if we don’t want to provide any cash flow to them when they’re people like boycott Amazon and stuff? So yeah, Amazon Prime, a lot of people use it. So people might call him out for this, but then also have amazon prime memberships? So it’s a bit of a, you know, internal conflict that they’d have to solve there. So he’s bringing up in like, Okay, I’m just gonna ignore say he is actually treating his workers badly, because I don’t know, I haven’t looked into it. Let’s just say that we can say that this is kind of positive effect, right on the wall. So this is the way he’s bringing it out. And people were like, Yeah, but we don’t need this kind of instant delivery low was so great. But like, I mean, it has positives and negatives, right. Everything does. I guess a better example, is in a mosque, right with everything they do. I think when he actually became the richest man in the world, he changed his
or he changed his pinned tweet, it’s not as pin tweet anymore. And it was basically someone back in 2018. He messaged me back in 2018. I don’t know what you know, Musk’s net worth was, but it was a lot lower than it is right now. Someone even tweeted almost then saying, oh, like you’re so wealthy, you have so much money, you should give it away or something. And then I don’t know, the original tweet is deleted, so I can’t see it. But then enormous replied saying, you should ask why I would want money. There’s no mask. The reason is not what you think very little time for recreation. I don’t have vacation homes or yachts or anything like that. About half my money is intended to help problems on the earth and half to help establish a self sustaining city on Mars to ensure continuation of all of life of all species in case Earth gets hit by a meteor like the dinosaurs, or world war three happens and we destroy ourselves. So to do something like that is incredibly ambitious. That even that’s an understatement to go tomorrow, set up a civilization there, you need an insane amount of capital to do that, like he like, and you need a lot of cash or just you know, a lot of net worth assets, to be able to leverage out loans and investments to be able to do this and burn cash for a long time before a company becomes profitable. Tesla’s Tesla has only recently over the last year become, like, consistently profitable, although you know, people argue about you know, their tax credits and stuff like that, that they’re selling, and that’s going to go away. But anyway, they’re becoming consistently profitable. Now, loads of these tech startups, when they start off are always not profitable all most startups are almost always not profitable. But they need investments, right, that’s where these seed investors, these Angel Angel investors come in to just give them money, because they believe in the product, or the service they’re providing would be beneficial, or you know, any to make money, and then they’ll make more money off that. But you know, Musk has put loads of his own worth with SpaceX, right? Which is also doing and that’s kind of the mission to actually get to Mars and create all of the, like, the infrastructure on Mars and stuff, and just the transportation to get there. You know, Musk has put so much of his net worth, or like his assets, and just stuff on like, SpaceX was gonna get burned, they were on the last rocket ship, they could literally just blow up and burn. Because they were running out of money, they were gonna go bankrupt, if it didn’t happen, the dude made a reusable rocket. If you’re going to tell me that he doesn’t need a lot of money to be able to do that, they burn through billions and billions to be able to do that. And he put a lot of his own money, I’m pretty sure I might be incorrect, but I’m pretty sure he put a lot of his assets or his net worth on cash on the line for that. If he didn’t have that, he couldn’t do that. And now he’s made spaceflight a lot cheaper, and what he’s doing to actually provide, you know, more positive, or, you know, more stable cash flow for SpaceX is starlink, that’s going to provide high speed, low latency internet, you know, hopefully, to the entire world, basically, I think, is that 93% of the world surface. So that’s even on boats and stuff. So in the middle of the sea, you don’t typically get high speed internet right now. But more importantly, certain potlights a, across some parts of Africa, or even still certain parts of India, India is on the other end of the curve, where, you know, they’ve hit that part where they’re getting a lot of reliable internet. And so yeah, Elon Musk is basically unlocking this entire world, to these people who just didn’t have access to probably the greatest resource in history. So he’s providing that for them. So he’s providing good in a different way. So you might get these extremely intelligent people in certain, you know, areas of the world where they just don’t have access either to the internet or the services or whatever to do to utilize the skills in a way that could get expanded or get noticed and stuff whereas now these people would you know, if Starling gets up and running in is reliable and stuff works out. It opened up a whole new world for those people and to us as well. So yeah, okay, the internet isn’t a necessity. What about food and water and poverty and that kind of stuff? 100% like valid argument. And, yes, that’s why a lot of these billionaires like, you know, Warren Buffett is put on his will that all of his money is going to go to charity. I don’t know which one Exactly. There’s the pledge. Right?
Daniel Redfearn 20:27
The pledge among the top billionaires.
Subaan Qasim 20:30
Yeah, yeah, something like that. I guess it’s the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation is sometimes controversial, or whatever, I guess, with Bill Gates, and but you know, he’s done a lot of Filip philanthropy and stuff. With vaccines, I guess. But again, people find that controversial, I don’t know, because I haven’t read into it. So I’m just gonna say, you know, he’s potentially done this, maybe he’s not, and maybe done some bad things as well, I don’t know. But you know, these people are still donating money to these kind of causes. But the accumulation of wealth happens over time. And it’s a compounding thing. So as your money gets bigger, it’s all as your net worth gets bigger, it becomes easier to increase it even more.
Daniel Redfearn 21:11
So you’ve got more capital.
Subaan Qasim 21:12
Exactly. So it kind of makes sense that they kind of hold on to it and go on the endeavors that they’re doing like you’re almost with SpaceX creating reusable rockets. That is like, Okay, I think making a reusable rocket, I think when they first initially said like, some people like, Man, it’s impossible, don’t even try. It’s like trying to throw a pen in it lands straight up. And if you didn’t think about the physics like, yeah, it’s extremely difficult. People would just thought it was impossible. But you know, where there’s a will there’s a way he so he managed to do it. And that’s gonna make it cheaper and everything. I mean, I’m just going on about it. But he needs a lot of capital to kind of remember the point I was saying, but
Daniel Redfearn 21:49
it was why they can’t sell off the wealth. So they have to keep the wealth to be able to have the facilities to change make changes.
Subaan Qasim 21:56
Oh, right. Yeah. So yeah, why? Why does an enormous just sell everything right now and just, you know, end world poverty or something? Well, one he can get, he can get even more wealth. Like, if there’s going to be a trillionaire. I think he might. He’s the person right now, who has the chance to get to become a trillionaire? I’d say because of the like, we’re still only at the inflection point for things like Tesla in terms of and his and thereby Elon Musk’s net worth going up? Yeah, so that means it’s gonna rise even more. So if you just hold everything up now. Then that says capital 180 something billion or whatever. Now, let’s just say 200 billion K, maxed out? What if that actually became a trillion or something? Okay. k trillion is extreme, because that’s so hard. A billion was hard enough to imagine a trillion Oh, my God. But okay, let’s even say that becomes 500 billion. That’s like two and a half times the amount of money. And at that scale, that’s huge. absolutely huge.
Daniel Redfearn 22:56
I mean, Elon Musk is already worth roughly similar amount of money as the GDP of New Zealand. So yeah,
Subaan Qasim 23:01
yeah. I mean, these kind of comparisons are funny, but like GDP and network like they, they’re slightly different. But yeah, exactly. It’s insane, that that amount of money, but he can make that he can make even more money, or like increase the net worth even more. And what you see with all of these, yeah, investment billionaire, like no investment, just being there people is that they tend to just write it in their way with all of their money is going to go to a set of charities, or go to certain companies that are going down these causes, right? So it doesn’t necessarily always have to be direct charity, say, like, directly acting to provide housing or something, if it’s, if they invest it into a company that is developing a technology that can make building a house easier, right? It’s good to invest in that because it will save costs and make it easier, right. But then people will say, but if they just gave all of their money right now, they could literally end it right now instantly. I mean, I don’t know, I haven’t looked at the calculations. And I’m sure the picture is probably bigger than that. Again, my stance on this is still fairly naive. And I definitely understand that if it if it was it, just possible it to do that. And it would actually be sustaining, then just do it. That would be my stance. So your stances
Daniel Redfearn 24:17
is not that they shouldn’t be doing more good with their money, but it’s just that they might not have the capacity to do as much good as some people think they could do. If that makes sense. No,
Subaan Qasim 24:29
I’m saying I take you know, Musk is still doing good. Solar, renewable energy saving the planet. And so
Daniel Redfearn 24:34
Elon Musk is a bad example. I’m saying more like billionaires who just have a bunch of money and like, who are not using that money for because Elon Musk is fairly unique, and the aims that he has kind of compared to, for example, billionaires who just have accumulated that through their family and stuff.
Subaan Qasim 24:53
Yeah, okay, find us different art. I’m mostly referring to these people who have kind of like in quotation marks around In terms of like, these companies, or they invested wisely and stuff, yeah, if they just have a lot of money just sitting around for safer inherent inheritance. Unless if they’d literally just sitting on it just for the sake of sitting on it. Yeah, I don’t think that’s good. I think they should actually donate it out, or at least, like I said, invested into these companies help these companies that are trying to make positive change in these certain areas, say, you know, certain medications or new technologies, that that could help, you know, take people out of poverty, or, you know, take plastic out of the sea and stuff. So, you’re investing into those companies are still doing good. Right. So then, I guess we’re the, you know, Musk is, I guess that’s probably why people don’t hate you know, Musk as much. I guess there’s also that notion that he’s just a normal guy, meaning on Twitter, he literally, he literally tweeted, our last thing a wise man wants to eat did he who controls the means controllable by Elon Musk? Oh, my God. He didn’t say a wise man, I’m adding that. So yeah, he who controls the means controllable. He’s just beaming on Twitter, he’s gone on the whole Dogecoin thing as well recently. And he’s just a normal kind of down to earth guy. And he seems with the people, even in the investing side of things is like, yeah, if you bring SpaceX public or starlink, public, or whatever, he’s gonna, like, guarantee some of those IPO shares to the retail investors, people who already have Tesla shares and support them, and quite a decent amount of people who just normal people I’ve invested in Tesla from quite early on. And they’re like, yeah, we’re gonna prioritize some shares for these people. Whereas Usually, people get access to these really early shares that are, you know, those are the ones that you make 100 x two or 300. x on your money, kind of thing, which these big institutional investors and banks get access to, but normal guys, I just don’t. But even he’s kind of written for us as like, you guys are deployed. So we’re gonna give you access to these shows? If he does bring it public. And who knows when that will be. But yeah, so people like him for that, and people can relate to him because he is kind of relatable. The dude made a flame for because he wanted to. Yeah, he’s joking around like his boring company. Oh, yeah. The boring company as well forgot about that one. Yeah. And he also saw the whole thing of PayPal, do you do kind of deserve the money at this point, change the way like online transactions, people back down? Like, what do you mean, online travel, people aren’t going to do this, or how they go wrong here. But, yeah, I’m basically like fangirling, Elan musk. But I guess in terms of what he has done, and he kind of requires that money to do these new ambitious stuff, like SpaceX and keep going with that and destroying ship after ship, I guess they have good investments now in SpaceX and good cash on about cash flow. But, you know, they have sort of investing in that, and, you know, it’s much more sustainable. And they’re gonna do that with starlink. But yeah, they, I feel like they shouldn’t sell their money, sell the stakes and stuff and give it to, like, just straight to the direct causes, if that’s better than what they can currently use their wealth for. I mean, it’s like, I’m saying, like, oh, providing money to give food for those starving his. If you can do something better than that, like that. That’s not what I’m saying. I just don’t have the vocab, or the eloquence to try and explain what I’m actually meaning. I guess we’re talking on like, large scale terms and stuff, because there are still inefficiencies in getting money, say to build houses and then having to get that. And if you just gave the money, like just straight out people Oh, yeah. If you can just see all the money that they printed out, like this year, because of Corona or like last year because the Coronavirus virus pandemic, they just kind of gave that level of money to everyone, then everyone would be out of poverty and stuff. But then it’s like, this concept to the whole universal basic income kind of thing. Is that sustainable? Like, again, there’s a lot of debates and you know, a lot of discussion around it. Okay, if you just gave everyone money, and now they’re out of poverty, that doesn’t really solve the problem entirely. Because you need to create a sustaining system, like a self sustaining like economy to actually sustain you give them the money once, okay, now they have a house, now they have a food for a certain amount of time. They need to still generate some kind of cash flow to continue with that, right. I guess it is a big thing to actually get them out of that out from under the poverty line, and into proper housing, proper food, proper education and stuff, but it still needs to be sustaining in some way. Man, this makes me sound like I’m against this kind of, like donating to charity, charity. But I’m not. I’m not.
It’s just hard to word. But I think there is the other side to the argument, which I’m probably not doing a good job of explaining where, you know, okay, they can accumulate even more wealth, and then it makes sense for them to carry on with their endeavors that are doing bringing up positive change with and that can’t be done unless they had all of this wealth and capital to be able to take on these endeavors and innovations and ambitions. And then a lot of the time Yeah, they will just kind of give their money to charity when they pass away because they can’t you utilize it. And I don’t know how many people can use it better, like utilize it better than these people. So yeah, I’ve rambled on for a long time, what what do you think? That’s kind of my viewpoint on it. But yeah, if they, if it was like confirmed, like you can legit just give all the money and provide all the resources like say food, water, shelter, education, everything, all the basic needs, right? If you give that and it just solves world poverty in every single way. And you can also make it sustainable, sustainable, and keep it going. And so it doesn’t just become relativistic. So then now the bottom of the batch is still in relative poverty to the top right. If that doesn’t happen, you can just do that, then I’d say just do that. Right. But I think is a lot more nuanced than people just say, oh, if we had this, then like this much money, then we could do all of this, I think there’s a still a bit more nuance to it. But that doesn’t take away from the fact that everyone, you know, if you have the means to you should be donating to these more directly charitable causes, like, you know, the people who are oppressed or in poverty and whatnot,
Daniel Redfearn 31:09
I think is a question of some of these topics. On the surface, it can seem like someone’s doing a really bad thing. But then, if you read a little bit more into it, it becomes clear that it’s really complex, if that kind of makes sense. Again, like, in the previous episode, we were talking about Robin Hood, and then stopping everyone from investing during the up curve on on with GameStop, it could well be that they did that with bad intentions. Yeah. But we also have to accept that we don’t know the full extent of it. And so when we’re thinking about why doesn’t Jeff Bezos, you know, make more money available? Why doesn’t he spend 100 billion on this giant project to you know, eradicate the disease? on my end, personally, I don’t know if that’s feasible. If that is feasible for him to do, then, of course, he should be doing that. And it’s, it’s really bad that he’s not doing that. But I also appreciate that it’s probably a lot more complex, and that he doesn’t have the May, maybe he doesn’t have the capacity to do that. I don’t know. It’s really, really difficult. But yeah, that’s kind of my stance on it is that they should, as a billionaire, you have the responsibility to serve society as much as you can. I mean, even the fact that you can make a billion dollars or pounds in this world is crazy, right? The fact that one person can accumulate that much wealth, when I say it’s your responsibility to serve society, okay, technically, it’s not your responsibility, because, you know, you didn’t ask for that, you just happen to accumulate a lot of money. But I’m saying, as a human being, you should want to be helping other people, you know, you’ve got more money than you could possibly want to do anything, you can’t possibly spend all of that money. So if you have literally a billion available, then of course, you should be using that to help as many people as possible. My point is that I’m wondering whether that’s actually there isn’t it’s not as simple as you just have a billion available, basically.
Subaan Qasim 33:10
Yeah, I think so. If people go on like these high net worth individuals saying, oh, sell out, sell out some of your assets to provide the money for this, then you should look to Apple, I think Apple actually have 200 billion just actually in their bank account in cash. They don’t know what to do with that money. But what the hell do we do they actually have that cash on hand PC just sitting there. I mean, it’s a two point something trillion dollar company, they are that cash, that you know, no matter how much r&d they do, they probably aren’t going to use all of that cash in any one go. So I guess it’d be better to kind of say like, oh, man up Apple should have the apple charitable fund or something where they these are going down these endeavors But yeah, I guess the keeping it for investments, reinvestment, since I guess, as a company, you have different requirements for your money, and, you know, they can’t just give it out. Right, I guess. I guess in theory, they could, but in reality, probably not. But, yeah, I think it’s a sticky issue. And I swear, everyone thought my foot like, formulated my thoughts properly around it. And I need to do a lot more research and reading into the, you know, key targets for actually solving these problems that we have with within the world, such as certain diseases that are epidemic within certain areas or certain regions, food, water, shelter, that kind of stuff.
Daniel Redfearn 34:40
I also really agree with what you said about the importance of not just giving a country a bolus of money because the inflation The problem is but even the problem being that you want to make sustainable change, right? So if I said to you, okay, here’s a billion help the most people you can would have to think you can’t just pay for a bunch of people’s dinners for six months, right? You can’t pay for a few 100 million people to eat nice food for a few months.
Subaan Qasim 35:10
That is literally what they’re doing right now, you know, with these stimulus checks, I guess they’re not being given money. They’re just creating, printing, printing the money in inverted commas. But it’s about.
Daniel Redfearn 35:23
And I know this isn’t groundbreaking information, this is very well known. But the best thing to do is to help build infrastructure, and maybe even education systems in countries where you have a generation of very capable people who can then focus on restructuring a country that’s been weakened for that for various reasons. And that’s a lot more complex to navigate. Right? So yeah, what I’m saying is what I would be doing with that billion would be I’ll try and I have to spend a lot of time researching, and then think now I’m not just going to donate this blindly. But I have to think, what can you do is that building roads is that building a good transport system in a country so that they can improve their facilities with trade, and then that can build up the infrastructure and open up a lot of jobs and then pull up people in society so that the average income rises, then people are buying things more, and then people can afford an education better. And if you help subsidize the education system, then you’ve got a whole generation of people who have degrees now and can build up an engineering industry. And it’s so complex, you know, it’s not as simple as just, I’m going to give that country a billion. So I can I can completely understand how the answer to a lot of these questions that I’m asking, you know, why? Why does Jeff Bezos not do more with his money? It’s not as simple as just, oh, he’s a terrible guy, and he refuses to help anyone. It’s more just that, to me to bring in something really long term sustainable is a really difficult thing to do. And, yeah, that’s not making excuses, because I think I’ve said it five or six times now. But it could be the case that Jeff Bezos is just hoarding a lot of money that he wants to buy some crazy, super yacht. And yeah, I don’t know.
Subaan Qasim 37:02
Yeah, I mean, that kind of just runs off nicely. So nice kind of summary as to what would probably actually be required to make something self sustaining. But again, I guess I have to do a lot more reading into it to kind of inform myself more as to what we can do even with small amounts of wealth, and to continually donate to charity for all sorts of causes, in terms of talking about charity, and you know, the ethical side of wealth accumulation and stuff I did want to talk about, you know, Islam’s view on wealth, and you know, when it’s good when it’s bad, and is it just inherently bad to have wealth and stuff? But I mean, it’s getting pretty late. So we’ll probably record it next week. So it will be the episode after this one, hopefully. So I guess we’ll just leave it at that for now. And I guess we will talk into some of the Islamic side of what Islam says on Monday next week.
Daniel Redfearn 37:55
Thank you very much around
Subaan Qasim 37:56
peace, peace. Thank you for listening to this episode of getting it.
Daniel Redfearn 38:01
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Subaan Qasim 38:08
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Daniel Redfearn 38:16
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